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Tuesday May 14th, 2002
McPartland rules over Piano Jazz
Talking with Marian McPartland is a bit deceptive. Underneath the bright British accent and warm sense of humor, her vast experiences and accomplishments show her to be the authoritative voice of the jazz pianist both past and present.
With a career spanning more than five decades, McPartland has recorded over 50 CDs, earned the Down Beat Lifetime Achievement Award, performed for the President at the White House and, with her National Public Radio program Piano Jazz, created perhaps the ultimate recorded history of jazz musicians. The show has captured McPartland performing and talking shop with hundreds of legendary artists. McPartland recently met with baldwinpaino.com to discuss her enduring passion for jazz, the piano and its players whom she knows so well.
As a teenager, how did you get into jazz? Was there a moment when a light bulb was turned on and you thought, Ive got to do that!
Oh, no, nothing like that. I just gradually got into it. I would hear music on the radio and I learned a lot of tunes, jazz and otherwise, just from hearing music on the BBC. But I did have this boyfriend who was a real jazz fan. He would come over to the house and bring recordings -- at that time 78s -- and play them for me. Thats when I really got into it. I had already heard many of these people on the BBC and now to have them all on records, and to be able to listen to them over and over again! Id just listen to everybody: Fats Waller, Teddy Wilson with Benny Goodman, and all his various groups with Mel Powell, Lionel Hampton, and Jess Stacy. I was tied into it completely and trying to play everything that I heard.
Did the BBC play much jazz? Ive heard that it was a real smorgasbord of musical styles.
It was. At that time they did more jazz than they do now. I remember they had one show a million years ago called The Society of Lower Basin Street. And Dinah Shore was in it. Now she probably is not your ultimate jazz person, but she was a very good singer and thats where I learned a lot of tunes. The big bands were then in full swing and there were so many of them and they all wanted to copy what was going on in America.
I did pick up tunes from the big bands. A lot of them had wonderful singers and they were really quite swinging and they had great personnel. It was the heyday of big bands everywhere. Those were my first influences. And then occasionally somebody came over to England like Fats Waller to play at the Palladium and Duke Ellington played in a club. I would hear about these people being in England and they might do a broadcast. But I never ever thought of going to a show. I was probably too young or too shy to even think about it. My parents probably wouldnt let me go anyway!
"Nowadays, if a parent tells me that their child is sitting down at the piano and picking out tunes or wanting to play, I say, Get that child a teacher."
Whats the most difficult aspect of learning to play jazz well? Is it the harmonic language or getting the right feel and making it swing?All of those things. Nowadays they have so many opportunities for kids to learn to play jazz. But for me, it was more of a natural thing. I didnt really learn it, it kind of happened to me! Ive never had a problem learning tunes by ear, thats one of the good things. I play tunes now that Ive never played before -- you just know how they go because you put the harmony and the melody together. Im sure a lot of jazz musicians would tell you the same thing. Theyve learned it by doing it.
If I had it to do over, I would like to have had piano lessons earlier than I did. I started playing when I was about three and my parents liked it, but they didnt do anything about it. Nowadays, if a parent tells me that their child is sitting down at the piano and picking out tunes or wanting to play, I say, Get that child a teacher. But I never had one until I was 19.
Is there another pianist who you would consider your musical soul mate?
Having done Piano Jazz for so many years, there are a lot of people who might fit that definition. Playing with Bill Evans was a great experience and we did get along very well. I wouldnt exactly call him a soul mate as much as someone you admire and are compatible with. I could also say George Shearing. When we sit down to play we certainly enjoy what we do. George loves to be a tease and be competitive and try to hang me up. But I guess thats a part of being comfortable with one another. I tell you who else is very good to play with is Dave Brubeck. And Oscar (Peterson). Theres actually a lot of others but I would say these are the main ones.
"You can play fewer notes and mean more than playing a lot of notes and running all over the place."
Do you think most musicians get better with age?I think so. In fact, I was just talking with Dave Brubeck the other day about that very thing. I think you develop more taste, youre more confident, youre more selective. Years ago, seeing how fast you could play used to be the thing, and I dont do that anymore. I dont think I can! You can play fewer notes and mean more than playing a lot of notes and running all over the place. I just feel altogether better about my playing. The one thing Ive always wanted is to swing as hard as Mary Lou Williams. I dont know if that will ever happen but I keep trying!
Has Piano Jazz evolved through the years, or do you focus on the same things today that you did at the start?
Yes, Piano Jazz has evolved. As you may know, weve stretched out to the extent of not just having piano players. A few years into the show I started thinking, Well, Dizzy Gillespie plays piano. Why cant we have him on the show and let him play some piano and the horn? Then we had Gary Burton and Gerry Mulligan. And then I thought, Well, why cant we have a singer like Tony Bennett? I would accompany him. So it got into that. Then, Why cant we have a drummer like Roy Haynes, and well hire a bass player but it will still be Piano Jazz. And we had (banjoist) Bela Fleck. Its still Piano Jazz , and we have a lot of instrumentalists who are not pianists, but theres enough piano because Im there. Nobody seems to mind. In fact, we got a lot of compliments on the show we did with Rosemary Clooney. People seemed to love that. And Im happy that we had Joe Williams. That was a great show also.
But there were some very good shows that we did in the early days, like the one with Bill Evans, and the first one we did with Oscar Peterson. I think the standard is still very high, with people like guitarist Les Paul. He doesnt play any piano, but why does he have to? And Kenny Burrell, another great guitarist. The show has evolved tremendously and theres no end in sight; anything that we havent done, were going to do.
Which Piano Jazz guest turned out to be the most different than what you expected?
I dont know if youve heard of Denny Zeitlin. Hes a wonderful west coast pianist but hes also a practicing psychiatrist and he has managed to handle both careers successfully. We had him on the show and hes one those guys whose ideas and technique are so strong ... although Id heard him on records I wasnt expecting to be absolutely overcome by his tremendous technique. I thought, My God, Ill never make it. Ill have to go to the rest room and take an aspirin! We talked about that on the phone recently, and now hes going to do the show again.
Id heard that Dave Brubeck was reluctant to visit Piano Jazz.
Oh yes. Years ago, he used to say to me, Ill never do your show. I asked why and he said, Id be too nervous. He kept saying this, so eventually I talked to his wife and manager and said, Cant you really talk Dave into this? And they did. So he said, Ill do it on one condition: that you let me bring my son Chris, a bass player. Then if I cant make it alone, well get Chris. I said OK. So Chris came and he stayed with his bass in the control room. And Dave started to play and got very animated. He did a wonderful show and never even mentioned Chris! He just absolutely got into it and the show was really good.
Has the profile of women in jazz changed for the better or worse in recent years?
Goodness, much better. Things have taken a total turn when you think of all these terrific players out there, like one that we just had on the show, jazz violinist Regina Carter. That woman is fabulous! She plays as well as some of the old masters like Stephane Grappelli or Joe Venuti. Wonderful. There are many more women on the scene now and more opportunities for them. And more women playing in bands, not to make a show of it, but because they are good players. Somehow the gender part of it is being forgotten.
Do you still get excited about Piano Jazz and live performances and do you plan to keep doing both indefinitely?
Id like to for as long as I can. Theres nothing to stop me right now. Piano Jazz is such a great thing because its kind of unique. I feel so lucky to be able to pick so many of my favorite people and have them come and do the show with me. It certainly does excite me just as much as ever. I think thats what is so great about music ... spending your life doing something you like to do. Not doing nine to five and hating every minute of it. Ive always felt I was lucky to be doing something that I wanted to do. And it also has some good in it for other people. Its not just a self-serving thing.
